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HomeMy WebLinkAboutCouncil Workshop Minutes 01.12.2010MINUTES COUNCIL WORKSHOP JANUARY 12, 2010 6:30 P.M. COUNCIL CHAMBERS A Council Workshop was held in the Council Chambers and called to order by Mayor Ken Olson at 6:30 p.m. on January 12, 2010. COUNCIL MEMBERS PRESENT: x Emelie Eaton _x . Kate Hart _x Chuck Rodgers x Alex Wilkins _x Doug Poehls Mark Mace _x Chuck Dickerson _x Norm Stamper OTHERS PRESENT: Sam Painter Mary Embleton Bill Sheridan Kurt Markegard James Caniglia Rick Musson Derek Yeager Public Input (three-minute limit); Citizens may address the Council regarding any item of City business not on the agenda. The duration far an individual speaking under Public Input is. limited to three minutes. While all comments are welcome, the Council will not take action on any item not on the agenda. There was no public input. General items • Ambulance Attendant Appointments Mayor Olson stated that the appointments of Jesse Kloberdanz and Josh Gibbs to the Laurel Ambulance Service would be on the January 196' council agenda. Planning: • Bus Transit Service James Caniglia introduced two representatives to provide information regarding the proposed transit system, Audrey Allums, with MDT, and Eric Forseth, who runs Rimrock Stages. Audrey Allums is the Transit Supervisor for the State of Montana. The Transit Planner, Adam Kraft, has been working with Laurel to help start up the service, but Audrey volunteered to attend and answer questions and provide clarification of Federal Transit Administration rules. MDT wants to see this be a successful system, but there are certain rules, regulations, and guidelines that have to be followed. Kate Hart asked regarding other Montana communities with a similar setup where this has been successful. Audrey stated that there are forty systems in small communities right now. This does not include Missoula, Great Falls, and Billings. The smallest system is in Jordan and the largest of smalls is in Council Workshop Minutes of January 12, 2010 Bozeman. The program has been successful. The element with Laurel is a little different because Laurel is so close to Billings and a commuter run is proposed. MDT wants to make sure that there is no reduction in the service within the community. The commuter run is a great idea to get people into Billings and back, but they want to make sure that the demand/response service continues to be provided in Laurel. The commuter run would make Laurel's program unique. There is a van pool service from Hamilton to Missoula, but that is a longer drive. Audrey stated that the program has been pretty successful, but the first year is usually pretty bumpy with ups and downs. Several programs are now in the third year and doing great. Libby, which is about the same size as Laurel, has been doing great. There are a variety of systems and MDT is flexible as long as the minimum criteria are met. The program must provide some sort of service 40 hours a week. Since the commuter service would not be running that much, the demand/response service with the Council on Aging needs to be continued and coordinated between the two services. Chuck Dickerson asked regarding providing a shelter in a centralized location to keep passengers out of the elements while waiting for the bus. Audrey stated that the majority of services in the state do not have passenger shelters. There is a company that will put up shelters for free if advertising is allowed in them for a certain amount of time. Chuck mentioned that passengers waiting at the new bus terminal in downtown Billings have caused a stir within the businesses as they use facilities and try to get out of the cold weather. Audrey stated the importance of talking to local businesses and planning the location of the rest stops. She knows that transit systems that have shelters for people to stay in actually have higher ridership because people are warm and comfortable and are not standing out in the elements. Doug Poehls asked Audrey to expand on her comment about needing 40 hours of service. Audrey stated that the money that will be provided to Laurel is for a rural general public system. One of the guidelines is that to be a general public service, it has to be available 40 hours a week. How a program is available is different all over the state. In Broadus, the system probably only runs three days a week, but someone answers the phone, sets up the system, and makes sure the rides are provided, so they are available 40 hours a week. The Federal Transit Administration knows that Montana is a small state with small towns, but the system must be open to the public so they know they can call somebody. If a service changes its hours and moves things around, it loses ridership because people then do not trust the system to be available when it is needed. Laurel has a demand/response system that works during the afternoons from Council on Aging and runs people around. Between the two systems, the numbers can be added together, as long as there is one place for people to contact. That is what needs to be discussed. Mayor Olson asked for an overview of the financial aspects of the program. Audrey stated that there is a required match. For the entire system, NOT will pay 80 percent of the maintenance costs, 70 percent of the administration costs, and 54 percent of the operating costs. However, the city can partner up with Council on Aging, add the costs of their afternoon commuter service, and use those costs as the city's match. Audrey has done grants management for over 20 years, and this is the only grant she has ever seen where Federal funds can be used to match Federal 2 Council Workshop Minutes of January 12, 20 10 funds. So the Federal Transportation money that the city is already getting from Council on Aging can be used to match the money that MDT will provide. She stated that it is really important to leverage those funds and any public transportation money can be used to match funds. Eric Forseth, the vice-president of Rimrock Trailways based in Billings, has been in business since 1972 and runs scheduled service all over Montana in most recently into North Dakota. Doug asked Eric Forseth to explain the requirements for his drivers and their hours. Eric explained that the drivers have to pass a drug screen, are subject to random drug and alcohol testing, and are subject to reasonable suspicion in both departments. Drivers are put through extensive training on each piece of equipment and are watched closely via GPS and cameras. Doug asked regarding a central contact location. Eric stated that Rimrock Stages has an existing office in Billings. It has an online ticketing system, which eliminates the need for cash exchange and ticket handling of manual tickets. The office has personnel from 5:00 a.m. until 6:00 p.m. and the hours might be extended, depending on manpower needs and availability. The shop is open 24 hours a day seven days a week. Doug asked if Rimrock Stages has experience with the demand/response operation that Audrey addressed. Eric said they have not had a lot of demand/response experience, but it would not be hard to incorporate it into the online ticketing. Friends in Salt Lake City do well with a demand/response from Rexburg through Idaho Falls to Salt Lake City using strictly internet. Audrey stated that she thinks maybe more work is needed on the coordination plan because that is probably not going to work all that well. The Council on Aging is already doing demand response during the day. They have a vehicle and they pick up people. Mary stated that the city is not involved in that at all, and it is strictly the Senior Center. Audrey stated that the only way this is going to work is if the two entities coordinate and work together because there has to be one place for somebody to call during the day. The commuter route is easy to set up. There has to be a person and the service picks people up and takes them into town. The demand/response that fills that gap is solely going to be up to the Council on Aging, so there has to be a little more coordination going on here than the two separate entities doing two separate things. Mayor Olson thanked James for bringing the two representatives together. Mayor Olson looks forward to the opportunity, should the council desire, to go forward to see how this transportation process would fit into the existing services provided to citizens. Eric Forseth stated that Rimrock already has drivers lined up in Laurel who are primarily charter drivers and are available for service during the week. Eric recently moved to Laurel, which allows him better ability to help out and fill in whenever needed. He is not just a Billings-based entity. • Energy Efficiency Block Grant 3 Council Workshop Minutes of January 12, 2010 James stated that the Energy Efficiency Block Grant is American Recovery and Reinvestment Act funding for public buildings to increase energy efficiency. City hall could definitely use some energy efficiency. Part of the application recommends getting a letter of support from the city council, and that is the reason for the presentation. The requirements are that any improvements need to be paid off in utility savings within an eight-year span. Johnson Controls is currently reviewing the building. The grant could be used for replacement of as many windows as possible in the building. There are two boilers, but one of them is very old and is asbestos lined. It will be a major problem to remove. However, the newer boiler is large enough to power the entire building and just needs to be trenched to provide heat in the council chambers building. Money is also available for solar and wind power, so James will include that request in the grant application. The city currently spends over $1,000 a month on energy costs for the building, which is substantially more than necessary. In parts of the building, the air conditioner comes on during the winter. These issues could be addressed with this grant, which is due the end of January. Johnson Controls is working on some things right now. James will write the grant after he hears from Johnson Controls. James requested that the council provide a letter of support. Kate asked if this is a matching grant. James stated that it is not. The city's only responsibility would be to pay Johnson Controls for their work to figure out the energy savings, which is a requirement of the grant. The city has to actually show the energy savings, and an independent assessment for the energy savings is required. Mayor Olson asked for a recommendation for the council's consideration of a letter of support at next Tuesday's council meeting. Chuck Dickerson recommended that a letter of support be presented. Mary asked regarding the need for a contract with Johnson Controls if this goes forward. Mayor Olson stated that staff should consider that. • CDBG Housing Grant James stated that the CDBG housing grant is an annual grant that assists first-time homebuyers and low income people with energy efficiency and other needs. The grant is due the end of this week. He explained that there are problems with Laurel's LMI, low to moderate income index. The Federal government steers these grants to cities or counties that fit the criteria where over 51 percent of the residents qualify as LMI, which Laurel does not. James is waiting for a response from the State regarding Laurel's LMI. Public Works Department: • Resolution - Request for Utilities Extension to new CHS Maintenance Complex Kurt Markegard stated that the city received a request from CHS Refinery in a letter from Pat Kimmet on what CHS plans or would like to do with their sanitary and water. Kurt asked Ken Billingsley, a representative from CHS refinery, to explain the request. Ken Billingsley, a project engineer at CHS Refinery, spoke to the council previously on behalf of the application for rezoning of property in the northwest corner of CHS's property. This request is related to the rezoning effort and the intended use for a maintenance complex. In the letter, the request is to extend three utilities, potable water, sanitary sewer line and fire water, to the proposed complex. The lines would all be run on CHS property and tie into existing utilities on site to serve the 4 Council Workshop Minutes of January 12, 2010 relocated employees. Consumption of the utilities would be no different than the current facility because it is just the number of employees being relocated. So the consumption elsewhere in the system and in the refinery would just be transferred to the new location. Ken stated that the design scope of the maintenance complex is still being developed. CHS is looking at certain aspects of that, so the information included in terms of consumption and line sizes is based on their initial thinking and anticipated maximum design. It might be smaller, but the final design is complex and is yet to be finalized. Mayor Olson asked Kurt Markegard to speak at this time. Kurt stated that CHS presented this a few months ago during a meeting with Ken Billingsley and Pat Kimmet about the extension of services to the refinery property. During that meeting, there was discussion about easements for water and sanitary sewer extension maintenance. At that time, CHS informed the city that there is a crude pipeline exactly where the PER calls for an easement. The pipeline was installed in the early 1990's. Maps showing the proposed easement location and the existing pipeline had been distributed for the council's review. The last page showed the pipeline 25- foot right-of-way on each side and how it snakes through the north side of CHS' property between the highway and below the interstate. That is where the PER, the engineering report, called for water and sewer extensions through that approximate location. It may be almost impossible to get water and sewer through that area because of the crude pipeline. DEQ regulations require a 10-foot separation in water and sewer lines, and then from CHS' pipeline would be 25-feet. One thing that was discussed was that CHS must maintain chlorine residual to their plants for public safety. The city is treating the water at its plant and must make sure that CHS has a chlorine residual at their facilities. The sanitary is going to be a 4-inch sanitary forced main back and the city requested that a meter be installed to provide a better way to bill for the sewer. Kurt stated that another manhole is needed so the city can monitor the service connection and be able to video the line. He asked that, if the council were to accept this proposal, that it would also require CHS Refinery to put another manhole in their connection in the main line. With another manhole, the city could monitor the flows and actually get in to clean some of the line. Fire Chief Derek Yeager stated that, in reviewing the preliminary nature of the drawings, there has been talk about sufficient fire flow. From the nature of the drawings and in visiting with CHS, the 10- inch fire main that is proposed from one of two locations would have the ability to be boosted by a diesel fire pump, or as many as two, which could add an additional 4,000 to 6,000 gallons per minute capacity through the 10-inch line. The actual number of efficient or sufficient fire flow is yet to be determined, due to the fact that the figure is compiled from the configuration and type of construction. Also, yet to be figured out is whether or not the proposed site is going to be included in Fire District No. 7 or excluded by the choice of CHS. Chief Yeager anticipates that the fire flow and the proposed drawings would be sufficient. Mayor Olson asked for council discussion. Doug Poehls stated concern regarding getting an easement for the inevitable growth of a subdivision southwest of town because CHS basically blocks the availability to the city's water and sewer plants south of the interstate. He recommends more discussion to see if the city can get an easement from CHS for water and sewer mains for additional expansion. Maybe the city cannot have an easement because of the crude line, but perhaps the city can get an easement that can connect to South 90' Street 5 Council Workshop Minutes of January 12, 2010 to run a main. He does not know if that could get through CHS's property, but he thinks an easement of some sort is needed. Kurt stated that the PER provided some alternatives for the location of the easements. One would be south of the refinery and required a lift station to pump it. Kurt stated that a lift station is needed. The engineer said it could be gravity fed all the way, but at some point a lift station would be needed on the west to get to the main head at the sewer plant. The PER lists all the options needed to get underneath the highway as the sewer line they are going to tie into is already underneath the highway. The city just expanded the 30-inch line to the property line of the highway right-of-way, so the city already has a main trunk line headed that way. For any additional trunk lines, the city could go under the interstate and through the south side of Laurel on South 56, which would mean crossing multiple times and coming back underneath the interstate on the south side. Doug stated that the issue is that CHS blocks everything south of the interstate. Kurt stated that some property south of the interstate is not owned by CHS at this time, so other landowners could be considered for an easement. As the city grows to the west, the city needs to figure out a way to get sewer through there. Mayor Olson stated that Kurt Markegard brought up sanitary metering and the manhole. The thing that perplexes him is, if this passes as is, the details have not been finalized and may change in the future. He is concerned whether the amount of change in the building construction would necessitate any change in the fire flows. The city's ability to mitigate and provide protection for the citizens of Laurel is of great importance. He asked Ken Billingsley if there would be such a change that the minimum piping to the fire flow would not be covered and if the infrastructure lines for water, wastewater, and fire flow, are set as to be the size indicated in the plans Ken stated that they are developed as a result of the basis selected to this point in terms of size of the buildings, number of occupants, and things like that. The anticipated scope would not be any larger than what CHS currently has. The actual required fire flow would be calculated once the size of the greatest user of the fire water, which they anticipate would be the warehouse, is determined and would be based on volume, materials stored in there, heights, and factors in terms of the size of risers and lines feeding the structure. Until the size is finalized, he cannot provide a required line diameter. At this point, it is safe to say that the size of the facility will not be any larger and quite possibly will be smaller. Mayor Olson asked if it would dictate smaller lines servicing the area if the facility is possibly smaller. Ken stated that it would as CHS would not want to put in anything larger than needed. However, if they thought there was future potential use off the header, they would consider installing a 10-inch line instead of the 8-inch line. Mayor Olson asked if chlorination and sufficient flow issues would still be addressed properly if the water requirements are reduced. Ken stated that the final design will satisfy the chlorination requirements and provide the residual necessary to make it safe. He assured the council and mayor that the final design will be satisfactory 6 Council Workshop Minutes of January 12, 2010 to meet chlorine residual. Since there are different ways to go about that and he does not know the final design yet, he knows that there would be a commitment for CHS to look after the employees and provide water that meets all requirements for health issues. Ken stated that that the final design will provide that the consumption utilities would not be any greater than what CHS anticipates right now. If the size of the facilities were determined in the end to be smaller, the size of the lines could be smaller but might not be, depending on whether or not CHS thinks there was a benefit for potential future use for that marginal capacity difference that would be given up by going to smaller lines. Chuck Rodgers asked if there is any possibility of getting a loop line in for fire water. Ken stated that is always desired in the design of a fire water system. It is possible but probably not with this project. It would be laid out for future consideration for how it could be looped if other loads were added on. In the end, CHS needs to insure adequate flow and pressure at the point of use for the facilities going in and the design would make sure that is the case. The looping could be potentially added at a future date but is not anticipated with this project. The fire water system is always looked at in terms of looping to be able to provide flow from multiple directions and is good engineering practice. They would incorporate it where it made sense because dead end lines are not as good as a looped system. In addressing Kurt's comments, when CHS met with the city last fall, the issue of the potential of providing an easement along the north side of the property was raised. As a result of discussion, CHS provided the information. From that meeting, it was their impression that the provision of an easement was not a requirement for their plans for the extension of utilities. It was only something that could be looked at to see if CHS could assist the city as well. Mayor Olson stated that his statement was correct. At the time, the city looked at it as a consideration that Cenex might allow. Ken stated that it is still the intent of CHS to assist where possible. Mayor Olson asked if the extra manhole was part of the language in the proposal. Ken stated that the manhole was not included, just the sewer meter. Kurt stated that the city could recommend and require CHS to include the manhole. Kurt stated that the rationale for the second manhole is that it is a long distance between the manholes. The city is incapable of cleaning the line at that distance. Within the city, the maximum distance between manholes is about 300 feet. We currently have a manhole that we know is there but has not been found. The city needs access in order to review possible groundwater infiltration into the sewer line, to monitor flows and to clean the lines and maintain the system. DEQ requires the city to review and limit groundwater infiltration. Chuck Dickerson stated that he would like the city to request adding the additional manhole. Mayor Olson stated that the council cannot make decisions tonight. He suggested that the city and Cenex representatives could meet to discuss the additional manhole. The council would have the option to require the manhole during consideration of the item at the next council meeting. • Resolution - NorthWestern Energy Agreement 7 Council Workshop Minutes of January 12, 2010 Kurt stated that a change in the electrical services is required for the wastewater improvements and replacement of the lift stations on Elm Street. The changes are outlined in a NorthWestern Energy Customer Agreement. The agreement allows NorthWestern Energy to start ordering the needed parts. The city is in construction at this time and waiting for submittals for the lift stations from the contractor, ESI. Once those have been submitted, the lift station components will be ordered. The self-contained units will be removed and the new units will be installed and the power will be hooked up. The agreement calls for a February 26 h deadline, but Mary spoke with a NWE official that agreed not to hold the city to the timeline if construction does not start in time. The electrical services have to be intermingled with the construction process. NorthWestem Energy has been working with the city's engineer regarding the specifications in the construction manual. Construction should move forward in March and April. Nearby residents will be notified when the electrical work is scheduled. Clerk/Treasurer: • Resolution - Annual $2.00 service fee for all water users On the previous issue, Mary noted that most of these agreements require payment in advance to the work being started. The city received permission to pay for it after the project is complete, so NorthWestern Energy is making a concession to Laurel. Mary explained that the annual $2.00 service fee is a statutory requirement that all public utilities are required to assess the customers on behalf of the State of Montana. It is a separate line item on the utility bills and is a state mandate that the city remits to the state after it is all collected. Chief Administrative Officer: • Resolution- Consulting agreement for review of insurance benefits Bill Sheridan stated that the city submitted a Request for Proposal to insurance companies to provide a response regarding employee benefits and related insurance considerations. Proposals are due on January 27th, after which the proposals need to be reviewed and compared to the existing employee benefits program An independent contractor agreement with Michael DiFronzo for review of the proposals was prepared and presented. Mayor Olson stated the contract is under $5,000 so a resolution is not needed. Executive Review: • Proposed joint meeting with the City of Billings Mayor Olson asked if the council would like to schedule a meeting with the City of Billings to discuss joint issues. After a brief discussion, the council requested that this be considered again at the January 261h council workshop. • Council Issues: o Update on the Asphalt Plant (Emelie Eaton) Kurt stated that Joe Gentri, MRL, informed him that the contractor encountered a large amount of leftover product at the Asphalt Plant site. The contractor is working to ensure that the product is safely and properly handled and removed from the site. o Costs for a standpipe (Chuck Dickerson) Mark Mace stated that the Public Works Committee reviewed an aerial view and some options for the city to install a standpipe. The committee recommended that the council look at doing something. 8 Council Workshop Minutes of January 12, 2010 The city already owns land at the city shop, and there would be a way for staff to watch the operation continually. Problems that might arise from it need to be explored, but it is a good start. Kurt stated that specific costs are on tonight's council workshop agenda. Kurt stated that the city did not budget for a water standpipe in the 2009-2010 budget. Public Works did not intend to install one and was looking at things like improvement of the water treatment plant, the distribution lines, and everything else. Public works has not yet been charged by the city council to install a water standpipe. The city would need to find funding, and the current reserves are set aside for the bonding and the loans on current projects. Northwest Pipe Fittings in Billings has contacts on how to get equipment. Initial controls and a valving system for one single unit would cost about $10,700. That does not include piping, back flow preventers, site concrete, or what to do with the overflow water. If the city council wants to go forward and get a firm cost estimate, Kurt recommends hiring an engineering firm to review the probable expenses and prepare a design for the chosen site. The Public Works Committee recommended the city shop site with access off South 5t' Avenue. There is also consideration for property on East Main across from the Owl Cafe. Rumors were that the railroad was going to expand there, but the letter from Joe Gentri explained that the area across from the Owl Cafe could be a potential site also as MRL does not plan to build there. There would be room behind the city shop and facilities are already there. Any other land around town would have to be leased or purchased. Lockwood installed a standpipe in the late 1990's or early 2000's and the costs were over $50,000. With similar costs, the city would have to go to bid and specifications would be needed, as per an engineering study. As far as access at the city shop, millings are available for the base, there are water and sewer lines and phone service, and there is adequate space to turn around. Public works is waiting for direction from the council as to its intent. Chuck Dickerson stated that he would like to see this go forward. Unless the city goes forward, the council will have no idea of the cost for the city's involvement. Funding is going to be an issue, but getting the necessary information will help the council decide the location. He stated that it is unfortunate that the city let the other one go, but he feels that the city needs to look at that to provide an alternative water supply to the non-residents to make things equitable on an even basis for everybody involved. Mayor Olson asked if there were any other questions or comments. Mayor Olson allowed the public to speak at this time. Wally McClain, 3555 Buffalo Trail Road stated: "I'm confused guys. I was here a couple weeks ago and I heard stories about you got pipelines, water lines in need of repair, you've got debt to solve, everything else, and here you are talking about an entity that you don't have budgeted for. One hand you are saying, we got to raise your water rates. You are proposing to tax Fox $8,000 a month for water because you are going broke. You guys can go ahead with this and keep one thing in mind. A smart entity makes sure that any revenue comes in covers expenses. She's talking about one being $10,700. By the time you built the facility and you paid the consultants, just because you run the water doesn't mean it's free. You better put a charge on that to cover all of your expenses, which puts you in direct competition with Fox. And if you put it at the city shops on city land, you'd better have your legal department tuned up because let one person slip and fall, they'll own you guys. This isn't a project to be taken lightly, especially after the big fuss you raised with having to bump the water bills sky high. Don't just jump at it because you are trying to challenge Fox. Think about it. $10,000 here, $20,000 there. It's only money that you don't have. " 9 Council Workshop Minutes of January 12, 2010 Bruce DeVries, 3550 Buffalo Trail, stated that "I am speaking up for our current supplier, which has been faithful, affordable, and there is one other aspect and I don't think a lot of you people might have thought about it, but there's five of us within a quarter mile out there that have 4,400 gallon cisterns and all of those are available to our local fire department, which is Molt. They got the right to come in ... and this way we can afford to keep them full, but I'm afraid if you raise rates like you are asking, it's not there. Fox's have been very, very faithful and good customers as far as I'm concerned they are good people. Thank you." Randy Pfeifle 9533 Laurel Airport Road, had a "couple comments. The city has obligations to supply water inside the city. You don't have an obligation to the people out of town. Fox do. They are buying water and reselling it. You are going to compete against a business that is paying taxes, paying GVW on trucks, getting their trucks repaired, running and checking on their water. They are taking the liability for the people that are filling up water there. You know, it's more than just a cash cow that they go and empty quarters out of. They do a lot of work over there. But the City of Billings put in a water spigot on South Billings Boulevard and they got shut down legally before they even made one quarter off it. And they had all the expense of putting it in. The building was in. The coin vendor was in, everything, and they never made a dime off it. And maybe your guys' legal defense is better than Billings, but they got it stopped over there, so that's something to consider before you go ahead with this. So, that's it." Fred Hankle, 7621 Hesper Road, which is halfway between 72"d Street and 80`h Street. I've been hauling water from Fox Water hydrant over there since they put it in. There's no fun in hauling water in the winter time. I'm getting knots on my fingers. When I go outside, I can hardly straighten my fingers out or bend them. That's not fun. And if you got to mess around in that kind of weather, you want to get some place where it's not going to take you all day to get it. I've talked to several people that used to get water here. They are getting water out of Billings now. The one guy says, I'm not going to Laurel any more. He says I used to go and get water, I stopped at Ricci's and got gas, I take my family and we go over to Laurel and have supper and then I get water. He says that's out. I've got the same impression. I went down and I rigged my truck up now so that I can get water out of Fisher Water Supply down on Holiday Drive and by golly, if it comes to that, I can get water down there for 25 cents for the 50 gallons just like I do over here. And if they can make money on it, why can't you make money on it? I know I'm not hauling that big of a load, but I haul water every week." Gary Hilyer, 1715 Lobo Drive, "it appears to me that we do need to increase some pricing. I'm not going to deny that, but I think to the extent that we are going is ludicrous and there's got to be a little different angle. I've been in business for a long time and I'm here to tell you you can't afford to do what you are trying to do, especially when you've already got Fox's that are all set up and ready to go and they are taking on the legal, they are taking on the maintenance, they are taking on all the different angles and somebody in one of the meetings a couple meetings ago mentioned we don't have the water stand here anymore in the city because we couldn't run it. The old one was torn down and we just couldn't afford to keep it going. Your costs have gone up considerably from those days, and if you are going to retain an engineer, you are going to drop $10,000 just to have him open the door for you. And you're going to end up sitting there with this guy's $50,000. To maintain it, to have a person on board, the legal rope that you are going to have to go on because you are a city entity versus a private entity, is much greater. Your liability is, like they were bringing up, is crazy, and I think there needs to be, if somebody is upset with somebody, I think the best way is maybe a couple people get together, sit down and have a cup of coffee and figure out what they can do, what benefits the city that is fair because when we look at this, we are not sitting in the situation to where your maintenance 10 Council Workshop Minutes of January 12, 2010 on that water and your water line, in my understanding, that's already in. You are not having to maintain, put up new, to each house your lines, I mean we have all talked about this over the past, but when you really think about it, the maintenance that you've got to maintain their water has to have some concession over the normal user, over the person that is in town, because your costs are less to maintain that one stand. Plus you don't have to look at taking out another entity. I think it's worthy of maybe Doug and the Fox's or somebody sitting down and having a conversation outside for a minute and go and, what's equitable and you can't throw your whole hand out, I'm not saying that, but there's got to be a different way than this is how it is and you're going to pay this because really people aren't going to come here. We could spend better time, and I'll do better at getting involved in finding ways to fill up the businesses that are empty in town that will help drive more money to your water systems cause all these empty buildings are costing us dough because there is nobody drawing water on them. And they are your bigger users, too. And that's fair. How do we stimulate the economy here? How do we get a grant that brings somebody in or do we have a group of people that's out there trying to lobby to bring other businesses here? I think that's important and I think there's a lot of other ways we can look at it. There's got to be a different way than we're going to oust somebody out of business. Fox's shut down, you don't have to, but you look at supporting it for the community effort. You can't feasibly do it. We know that. I appreciate your time. Thank you." Mayor Olson asked if anyone else wanted to speak. There was no response. Mayor Olson stated that the city is taking a step forward to make some comparisons to insure that the direction that would best serve the city has been investigated. Mayor Olson charged Kurt to continue and stated that information would be provided to the council in the upcoming weeks. He stated that, for those interested in following the issue, the council agenda will be posted every time the subject will be discussed and information is presented. He asked that future repetitive public comments be condensed if the same information is presented so the council's time can be used as constructively as possible. o Dips in First Avenue South (Chuck Dickerson) Kurt stated that there was some trench settlement on South I" Avenue. The State has planned a chip seal for the entire project this spring and the issues with the dips will be addressed. o Motor home located in the 100 block of 86' Avenue (Mark Mace) Chief Musson stated that he tried but could not find the motor home. o List of questions regarding Public Works actions late December 2009 (Emelie Eaton) Kurt answered a list of questions regarding Public Works' actions while trimming trees in the alleys. The Public Works Department is in charge of collecting solid waste in the alleys and has to operate the equipment in the alleys and provide regular maintenance in the alleys. The department tries to do maintenance work in the alleys every third year. Last year the city spent a lot of money on gravel. The issue tonight is about trimming trees in the alleys. 1. Where in the Ordinances does it state that the Public Works Department is in charge of public safety? Kurt stated that there is no ordinance that says Public Works is in charge of public safety. The City's Rules and Regulations for Street and Sidewalk Construction state that "all maintenance and repairs of public streets, alleys, sidewalks and other public ways shall be under the supervision of the Public Works Director." The Rules and Regulations and the Laurel Municipal Code are the bible on how the 11 Council Workshop Minutes of January 12, 2010 Public Works Department operates regarding tree and street issues. Kurt stressed that staff always refers to these when dealing with any issue. The Rules and Regulations were prepared by Morrison- Maierle in 2003 and adopted by the council in 2005. Kurt believes that, not only does the Public Works Department have a responsibility for public safety, but the council, by the passed legislation, has a share of responsibility, along with the mayor, chief administrative officer, police, fire, and all city employees. If an employee sees anything out of the ordinary, the city has to try to insure that no one is harmed. a. What threat exists that prompted the Public Works Department to clear the alleys? Kurt stated that there is no threat. There is a condition, and that condition is the over vegetation of the alleys. The city's trucks go through the alleys, the mirrors are ripped ofl the antennas are broken off, and it is hard for the operators to safely operate the equipment if mirrors have to constantly be readjusted or replaced. The mirrors cost about $450 to replace. The complaints are coming from the solid waste drivers as they go down the alleys and cannot see. Kurt has tried to contact the solid waste employees and found out that their radios do not work because the antennas were broken off. Public works is responsible for the entire 20-foot right-of-way in the alleys. It is hard to quantify where the alleys are, but they go off people's fence lines, which are required to be on private property, power poles, and the driveway approaches at the end of each alley. The driveway approaches should line up going north and south. A lot of the alleys have vegetation growing in them. When the department blades the alleys, they hit roots that are growing out of people's yards and they run into vegetation all the time. They also run into people trying to plant things in the alley, and code enforcement addresses those issues. Vegetation cannot be planted in the alleys, which are for public right-of-way access. b. Has the Police Department been notified of this threat? Kurt stated that he has never been notified by the Police Department, but any time the police call, the Public Works Department responds to the complaint. C. Do the police patrol the alleyways? Kurt stated that Rick would have more on that, but he thinks they do. When the drivers encounter vehicles in the alleys, the Police Department is called. The police respond and remove cars or contact the owners because they can check license plates. Public works relies on the police to do a vehicle check to find the lawful owner of a vehicle and then try to remove the obstructions. As far as trees, the police do not patrol. d. Is there supposed to be an annual safety check of the alleyways and if so where is that Ordinance? Kurt stated that there is no annual checklist. 2. Are the alleyways supposed to be one or two lanes? Kurt stated that the alleys are 20 feet and lanes are not designated. Alleys are for public right-of-way for people to navigate. The city requires that alleys are navigable all the time. By ordinance, an alley can be blocked for 15 minutes to load or unload. The Police Department, not the Public Works Department, would address this issue. 3. What is the speed limit in the alleys and does that apply to everyone? 12 Council Workshop Minutes of January 12, 2010 Laurel Municipal Code, 10.20, states: "Fifteen miles per hour in any of the following zones: City alleys." 4. What ordinance states the alleys should have a clear line of vision for an entire block or more? According to LMC 12.32.150: "The city shall have the right to plant, prune, maintain, and remove trees, plants, and shrubs within the lines of all streets, alleys, avenues, lanes, squares, and public grounds as may be necessary to insure public safety or to preserve or enhance the symmetry and beauty of such public grounds." Kurt stated that the city has a right to maintain the lines in the alley right-of-way. a. If there is an ordinance that the Public Works Department was following, is it new because some trees and shrubs had been in place for a minimum of ten years. Kurt stated that, as far as he knows, the ordinance pre-dated the Tree Board and the creation of redoing the trees. The ordinance has been there for many years. He knows it was there when he started working and prior to the tree ordinances being reworked. 5. Why doesn't the Ordinance that applies to the trees on boulevards apply to the trees and shrubs in the alleys? Kurt stated that the ordinance states all right-of-ways. Streets and alleys are the right-of-ways for public access, so they should be treated exactly the same. The city does not do a lot of garbage collection on the streets as it would destroy the streets. If there was garbage collection on the streets, the city would trim the trees in order to accommodate the solid waste collection. Regarding the boulevards, if there is a sewer manhole in a location that the equipment cannot access and it is an emergency, it might be necessary to chop a tree or branch or whatever is encumbering the truck. Anything that interferes with the operation of the city to make sure that water, sewer, storm, alleys and streets are safe would have to be done. a. Why aren't citizens informed when they are not in compliance? Kurt stated that some are informed and it is done based on complaints received. After a complaint is received, code enforcement reacts and gives notice to correct the violation. Violators are given ten days to respond. If they do not respond within ten days, another notice is sent for a correction. Code enforcement does not want to cite them. If the city had to start citing every violation, the system would bog down as there are numerous trees in alleys and over streets and sidewalks. Some streets have low-hanging branches, which make it difficult for the fire trucks to pass through. The city would like to address these issues, and the DNRC would like to help get grants to address the trees in the city. Unfortunately, there are budgetary concerns to enforce every need. Kurt stated that the department tries to inform the citizens, but there has not been a good way to do so. Attempts will be made to post notices on the city's website and in the Laurel Outlook. b. Why aren't citizens given the opportunity to remedy the situation the same as applies to boulevards? Kurt stated that an off-season complaint regarding one tree in an alley could be addressed by code enforcement. But when the maintenance was done citywide, it was difficult to inform everyone regarding the trees in their alley. C. Why did the City have to send untrained personnel to do as much damage to the trees and shrubs as possible? 13 Council Workshop Minutes of January 12, 2010 Kurt stated his objection to the word "untrained". Public Works trains the personnel on how to trim trees. Unfortunately, the best way to trim trees is actually in the yard at the base of the tree, but the city does not like city crews to enter private property. The city's pole saw reaches up to 13 feet, which enough to trim so a tree does not encumber the trucks. The city has a chipper, which is run in a pickup and used to clean up the branches. Maintenance was done in 2001, 2006 and in 2009, and is planned to be done every three years. If maintenance is not done, trees would grow into the alley and more damage could be done by hooking the trees with the garbage truck and possibly breaking the tree or branch inside the property line. The city has to be able to get the road grader and solid waste vehicles in the alleys. d. Why weren't the offending trees or shrubs completely cut out instead of being left as damaged stubs? Kurt stated that the city tries to do the minimum amount of work possible to be efficient. The crew cleared everything right at the property lines for maintenance and the operation of the solid waste trucks. The city could take out all the vegetation and grade the alley to 20-feet wide in gravel, but it would take a long time to do that citywide. The city tries to do the minimum amount necessary and use time as efficiently as possible to make sure the solid waste trucks can get in there and the drivers can see all the way around. e. Why was this work done in December? Kurt stated that deciduous trees and most trees are typically in dormancy in December. The DNRC forester recommends trimming when there are no insects flying, as there is less disease transpired between insects then. Insects and trees are dormant and that is the best time to do tree trimmings. 6. Why isn't there an Ordnance that clearly states what height and width is allowed for trees ad shrubs in the alleyways? Kurt stated that LMC 12.32.180 states that "every owner of any tree overhanging any street or right- of-way within the city shall prune the branches so that such branches shall not severely obstruct the light from any street lamp or obstruct the view of any street intersection, and so that there shall be a clear space of thirteen feet above street surface or eight feet above the sidewalk surface." The city considers the street and alley surface to be thirteen feet. The Rules and Regulations adopted by the city council specifies 14 feet. When the garbage truck is fully extended with a garbage can it is 15'6", so even current ordinances do not address the height requirements needed. The trucks often hit Cable Montana lines, which are put at 14 feet because the DOT requirement on highways is 14 feet. A permit is needed to move any vehicle higher than 14 feet through the state highway system. 7. Why was this action taken against the residents of only the south side of town? Residents from other parts of town have received letters giving them a certain amount of time to trim trees or shrubs in the alleyways. Kurt stated that no letters were given out for any of the alleys and the city trimmed all trees in the alleys. When he drove some alleys today, he could see little nubbins where some of the hedges and trees were trimmed back. Kurt stated that it was done citywide, and no action was taken on a particular side of town. Mayor Olson stated that Kurt did a fine job. The city is often accused of not being diligent in code enforcement and the like. He uses the words proactive and reactive. Budgetary restraints allow the city to be just reactive. If the city was proactive, there would be budget issues. Often discussions 14 Council Workshop Minutes of January 12, 2010 over why certain things are done at certain times boil down to the amount of money it takes to maintain a specific service. Mayor Olson thanked Kurt for his report. Kate Hart stated that it was good to see the crew go through her alley. She mentioned that a bush was cleared out in an alley, allowing a driver to see if a child is standing on the sidewalk. She stated that it is a great service. Other items There were none. Review of draft council agenda for January 19, 2010 The letter of support for the Energy Efficiency Block Grant will be placed on the January 19th council agenda. Mary mentioned the need to schedule election of the council president and vice-president. These will be added to the January 19'h council agenda. Attendance at the Janu 19, 2010 council meetmL All council members present will attend. Announcements Norm Stamper mentioned that the Cemetery Commission will meet on Thursday at 5:30 p.m. to discuss fees, placement of the Rosselot plaque, plans for the veterans' section, and the sprinkler system. Chuck Dickerson received comments regarding the lack of snow removal from some sidewalks in the city during the recent snowstorm. He asked staff to publish the ordinance in the newspaper regarding property owners' responsibilities to maintain sidewalks. Kurt stated that complaints are relayed to the code enforcement officers, and the city clears the sidewalks around city buildings and facilities and sands the crosswalks in a timely manner. The council workshop adjourned at 8:38 p.m. Respectfully submitted, C Cindy Allen Council Secretary NOTE: This meeting is open to the public. This meeting is for information and discussion of the Council for the listed workshop agenda items. 15